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Dr. Rachel Werner

Podcast 212: Are We Measuring Health Care Quality All Wrong? w/ Dr. Rachel Werner, Professor of Medicine, UPenn

Jul 24, 2026

Episode Summary

Decades of quality measurement programs were designed to make U.S. health care better. The evidence suggests they have, just not nearly as much as anyone hoped, and sometimes in ways that hurt the patients who needed help most. Dr. Rachel Werner, Professor of Medicine, Perelman School of Medicine at the University of Pennsylvania, joins host John Marchica to examine why well-designed quality incentives so often produce unintended consequences, and why the long-term care system, despite years of reform attempts, remains structurally broken.

Episode Notes

Decades of quality measurement programs were designed to make U.S. health care better. The evidence suggests they have, just not nearly as much as anyone hoped, and sometimes in ways that hurt the patients who needed help most.

Dr. Rachel Werner, Professor of Medicine, Perelman School of Medicine at the University of Pennsylvania, joins host John Marchica to examine why well-designed quality incentives so often produce unintended consequences, and why the long-term care system, despite years of reform attempts, remains structurally broken.
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🎙 ABOUT DR. RACHEL WERNER
Dr. Rachel M. Werner, MD, PhD is a Professor of Medicine at the University of Pennsylvania Perelman School of Medicine and Professor of Health Care Management and Economics at the Wharton School. She also serves as a physician at the Philadelphia VA and is a Core Investigator with the VA HSR&D Center for Health Care Evaluation, Research, and Promotion.

Over the past two decades, Dr. Werner has built a research program examining the effects of health care payment and related policies on care delivery. She has investigated the unintended consequences of quality improvement incentives and was among the first to recognize that public reporting of quality information may worsen racial disparities. Her work has been published in NEJM, JAMA, and Health Affairs, and she has served on advisory committees to state and federal government agencies and research foundations.

Dr. Werner has received numerous awards including the Presidential Early Career Award for Scientists and Engineers and the AFMR Outstanding Investigator Award. She is an elected member of the National Academy of Medicine and holds both her MD and PhD in Health Economics from the University of Pennsylvania.

🎙 ABOUT HEALTH CARE ROUNDS
Smart conversations with the people moving health care forward.

Health Care Rounds podcast brings together the leaders changing the future of health care and pharma, from how it's delivered and paid for, to where it's headed. Each episode goes deep on the decisions, innovations, and ideas reshaping the industry from the inside out. Hosted by John Marchica, CEO of Darwin Research Group and a longtime industry insider, every episode has one goal: leave you thinking differently than when you arrived.

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Podcast 208: The Affordability Crisis Behind Value-Based Care w/ Dr. Michael Chernew, Harvard
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Podcast 205: Why Health Care Treats Instead of Prevents w/ Dr. Barry R. Davis, Author, The Preventioneers
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